I liked this episode more when I watched the rerun, the 12 Angry Men stuff bored me a little the first time, but I was a little drunk the first time. I think it was the '09ers and not the PCHers who wrote "Muchas Gracias Bitch!" on Veronica's car, but I could be wrong. I thought Meg's death was too predictable after last week's alternate ending.

Great recap J-Unit, and please never ever use the term LoVe again, puppies die from sugar shock everytime that phrase is used! Also side note: Keith couldn't stay awake for New Years, not Keith's dad.

Do you really think that the PCHers did that to Veronica's car? Was it because of the "Latin" words?

Also, I believe that Logan's reasons for watching the videos before destroying them was more of an emotional one than one related to his father's trial. That was just the motive that he provided to Keith. I'd bet that the defense could get Logan's testimony thrown out due to the way he acquired the tapes.

It was the '09ers who did the window painting thing. You get that from the voiceover and the fact that one of the '09ers did it when she went to the party where she was roofied. The only reason it's in Spanish is because they basically tried the kids for beating up a Hispanic girl and yeah, that's thier way of showing thier "appreciation" of the kids being found guilty of the crime.

I thought the Meg dying thing was far too predictible because that's what happened to her in the alternate ending but her fate was sealed the moment she told Veronica to take care of the child. That was the biggest anvil I have ever seen, so I wasn't surprised at all when she died.

There is just so much stuff to try and figure out this season. Why, would Meg worry that something was going to happen to her? That was just weird that she just died. She has more of a back story to explain. Were there complications because of the crash? I think most definitely the '09ers wrote "Muchas Gracias Bitch !" on her car. At least that was my impression, it's a very Dickish thing to do. One thing that bugged me in this post was, "it can't be any worse than that Echolls kid getting into her pants." See, from the first episode of season two, I got the impression that V and Logan never consummated their relationship. I just gotta defend V's honor. It seemed like when they were making out in his yellow SUV, she wasn't really letting him go that far, which is why she was making such a big deal about sleeping with Duncan in the earlier episodes. I also think it adds some extra tension between V and Logan.

"And let's be honest, if there is no money shot, "One Night in Lilly" is not going to be worth all that much." Maybe it's because I'm a simple man, but I couldn't stop laughing at this.

Anyway, I agree that while this episode was good I don't necessarily agree with killing off Meg. While I think it would have been interesting to see what happened with Meg, I have a feeling that the results would have been too soap operaesque. I'm curious to see how the writers explain a high school senior dying of a cardiac embolism (blood clot going to the heart). It did travel to her heart, not her lungs, right? In any case, I think the reason that Meg's death didn't have much of an emotional punch was not because we could see it coming (from her comment to Veronica about protecting the baby), but because we didn't really get to see many reactions to the news. Veronica cried for a few minutes then it was on to the New Year's ball drop and Wallace's return. I'm not saying there should have been a montage of the characters crying with no audio except for a classical music score, something that Lost has used way too much BTW, but I felt like it needed something. I hope we get to see more development of the Meg-Duncan story in the coming episodes.

Although I'm happy to see Wallace back, I think they could have ended the episode with Meg's death and brought back Wallace at either the beginning or the end of the next episode. I guess the writers wanted to bring him back before the month long break.

I agree, nancydrew77. When she went to Logan's to warn him that Big Dick knew about Kendall and Logan, the bedroom was all messed up, and Logan said something to the effect "now you know what you missed". Totally indicated to me that they had never consummated their relationship.

There are other things you can do in someone's pants other than sex. Also, Keith (I hope) doesn't keep track of details of his daughter's sex life and could think Logan got in her pants. Either way, I thought that bit, along with the one night in Lilly comment, were funny.

I am new to Veronica, so could someone please explain who the O9ers/PCHers are? Thanks! Also, maybe times have changed, but I didn't know high-schoolers could be jurors?

YES! I've shared my curse with J-Unit! I'm the poster who can't get that damn song out of my head!

Meh on the episode- can't wait until January though!

Duh! I know you don't have to have sex to get into someone's pants. My point was that I think with Logan, V was very guarded and I think she was pretty cautious regarding their physical relationship not wanted it to go too far.

Marie, the 09ers are the rich kids who live in the 09 zip code (Neptune's version of 90210.) The PCHers are the hispanic gang led by Weevil who are representative of the "have nots" in Neptune.

As for a high school student being on a jury, Veronica is 18 which means she could be summoned for jury duty. I seriously doubt she would have lasted through jury selection, though, because I think the attorneys would assume that a high school kid, even one who is old enough to vote, is too young to serve.

Incidentally, I don't understand why Meg's parents would have any rights over the baby. Duncan, as the only surviving parent, would have the say, and they couldn't force him to give up his parental rights. If he wants to keep the baby or put it up for adoption in a normal process that isn't based on indoctrination, then he can and they can't stop him.

I like these MOTD ("monster of the day" as used on Buffy) episodes that are pretty self contained but slowly reveal a little of the overall plot but the main thing I took from this episode is that Veronica will be in Neptune next year going to college. I love this on shows where the kids go to high school in a small town and when it's time for them graduate, a university suddenly pops up in their town we've never heard of before complete with every course of study, an olympic size swimming pool for scare scenes and a every sport possible.

http://www.forbes.com/technology/ebusiness/feeds/ap/2005/12/13/ap2387972.html

So apparently Meg's baby surviving a bus crash isn't all that out of the ordinary if you consider this woman was pregnant and fell out of a plane.

I am a law student, and trust me, Ashes, there have been naaaaaaasty custody battles over matters such as this.

maybeimamazed (post #15), while they could petition the court to be named legal guardians, Duncan is the biological parent and therefore has parental rights. Only if the court terminates his rights or he gives up his rights will someone else have legal say over the child. Given that Duncan is 18, has plenty of money with which to support a child, has never been accused or suspected of abuse, and is the biological father, I seriously doubt a court would terminate his rights in favor of grandparents against whom there is suspicion of child mistreatment. While I know that the parents could cause a court battle over it, my point was that the presumption will be that Duncan is the parent and has the right to raise the child or put the child up for adoption.

We'll see how the writers handle this storyline, but if they show Meg's parents automatically having custody of the baby just because Meg died or being presumed to have the right to determine the child's fate, it will be legally inaccurate and silly.

As far as legal custody of the kid goes, Meg's parents could probably argue that Duncan is unfit due to his fits of craziness when he goes off his meds. This alone isn't a good enough reason for Duncan to lose custody, especially since Duncan hasn't abused Meg or the child and Meg's parents like to lock one of their daughters in the closet for punishment, but let's not forget that Duncan has issues (besides the lack of a personality). However, Duncan can afford the best lawyers money can buy so he shouldn't lose custody.

Just curious, does the fact that Duncan and Meg were never married have any effect on the custody decision? I know that Meg and Duncan are both adults, but I know very little about child custody laws and I'd like to learn more.

Weston, whether they were married isn't an issue when there's a biological parent. A biological father automatically has rights--in fact, there have been real cases where an older child was taken away from adoptive parents, the only parents the child knew, because it turned out that the biological father hadn't known about the baby and still had his parental rights.

While you raise a good point about Duncan's medical history, that isn't going to trump both the system's presumption that a biological parent is the best person to be in charge of a child and the fact that there are multiple witnesses (Duncan, Lamb, Veronica, Meg's sisters) who can at the very least raise suspicion about Meg's parents' fitness.

Yes, it will be a huge mistake if custody automatically goes to Megs parents. EVen if DUncan was not 18 he still has legal rights as the biological father. Unless of course DUncan is a Jackass and lets her parents have custody becasue he cant deal with having a child. WHat the hell is V suppose to do about it? She doesnt have any rights when it comes to the child. Although I guess she could help DUncan. It soging to be interesting to see where the writers take this, Ive read not justy once before in these comments that once you bring a baby storyline into the equation its hard to get out of before things get seriously screwed up.